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Fish in QT!!! (1 Viewer)

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Illusiveman

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Well, I learned my lesson. I got in a hurry on a couple of things, not sure exactly the variable that caused it, because I have been careful, but i'm certain that I got velvet. I was almost certain I was going to loose everything because how bad it looked, but I may have caught it in time. Everything was going good and I added a few more snails and a cool looking rock and then Bam!! three days later white and black spots that I can't even count. I suspect the snails because the rock came from a friends tank, I was trying to spread some coraline, and he is much more cautious than me.

Its been three days now, everything seems to have survived. Clowns and the Flame have no spots, but the Tang is still struggling a bit. It's started eating now and swimming more so I think the worst is over.

Just in case anyone is curious, i'm running hypo salinity at 1.010 and still working the cuprion up. I just hit 0.15 tonight. I've never done hypo salinity before with copper treament, but I feel that hypo salinity is what saved the fish.

I won't add anything back to the display until November 10th just to make sure everything is good.
 
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Illusiveman

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Looks like you got lucky.

Trust nothing, and even stuff that should be safe I at least put in "observation".

Absolutely. I've always been prepared for it. I've had the QT tank cycled just as long as the display because I didn't want to have a problem with ammonia, however, preparing for a disaster doesn't make sense when you can choose prevention. Everything will be observed and treated as needed before going in the display from now on.

I feel that this is almost like a rite of passage. Everyone thinks there invulnerable until they realize they are not. I've read so many post about QT and I didn't think it applied to me. I post this for others to not make the same mistake I did.
 

Humblefish

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I would be careful running hypo with copper, as the latter becomes more toxic in lower salinity. Hypo will suppress velvet, but will not completely eradicate it. I would start raising the salinity back up as you raise the copper level to therapeutic. Which I believe is 0.20 ppm for Cuprion.
 
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Illusiveman

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I would be careful running hypo with copper, as the latter becomes more toxic in lower salinity. Hypo will suppress velvet, but will not completely eradicate it. I would start raising the salinity back up as you raise the copper level to therapeutic. Which I believe is 0.20 ppm for Cuprion.

0.20 ppm is correct for Cuprion. Good to know about the toxicity of copper in lower salinity. I will start raising it slowly. I'm thinking about .002 a day, so that's about two weeks to get it back to 1.026.

Can anyone tell me if copper will have an effect on testing for nitrates? I'm using Red Sea and i'm just curious.

Update: All fish are still alive and everyone is eating. Most of the visible spots are gone on the Tang and all the color has come back.
 

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I'm sure you already know this but I'll just throw it out there for others that might not know and be following along.

Never use an ammonia reducer with copper as it will turn the copper into a much more toxic form.
 
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0.20 ppm is correct for Cuprion. Good to know about the toxicity of copper in lower salinity. I will start raising it slowly. I'm thinking about .002 a day, so that's about two weeks to get it back to 1.026.

Can anyone tell me if copper will have an effect on testing for nitrates? I'm using Red Sea and i'm just curious.

Update: All fish are still alive and everyone is eating. Most of the visible spots are gone on the Tang and all the color has come back.

I’d try to bring up the salinity a little faster than that. That way you can ramp up the copper quicker. You need to achieve the therapeutic level so that velvet doesn’t explode again. The quarantine clock doesn’t start until you reach therapeutic. Good luck!
 

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1) As Reefaholic mentioned, bring the salinity within 5-7 days
2) Using an ammonia reducer with Copper makes it more toxic and reduces oxygen in the water, therefore fish will suffocate
3) When using Copper, it will affect your Nitrate readings.
4) If you are not in a rush for QT, I would keep your hypo-salinity for 10 days to treat flukes, while raising salinity, you can treat General Cure, and once you are back up to 1.024 / 1.025, you can then treat with Copper.
 

Humblefish

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Can anyone tell me if copper will have an effect on testing for nitrates? I'm using Red Sea and i'm just curious.

The presence of copper renders all test kits ineffective. You will get false positives. The two exceptions to this is the Seachem ammonia alert badge and a Seneye monitor.

Never use an ammonia reducer with copper as it will turn the copper into a much more toxic form.

This is true when using ionic copper like Cupramine or Cuprion. However, it is safe to use an ammonia reducer with chelated copper like Coppersafe or Copper Power. Recent testing has also proved that a UV can be used with chelated copper for clearing bacterial blooms: Chelated copper + UV = SAFE
 
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The presence of copper renders all test kits ineffective. You will get false positives. The two exceptions to this is the Seachem ammonia alert badge and a Seneye monitor.



This is true when using ionic copper like Cupramine or Cuprion. However, it is safe to use an ammonia reducer with chelated copper like Coppersafe or Copper Power. Recent testing has also proved that a UV can be used with chelated copper for clearing bacterial blooms: Chelated copper + UV = SAFE

Well that’s good news! Who/how did they find this out about Chelated copper? Very Interesting...I sure wouldn’t have tried it. :)
 

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Yes, Mr. HumbleFish informed me about this and I used one of my three canister filters with UV in a 40-gallon breeder with Copper Safe for a few months.
I maintained a 2.0 therapeutic level for 30 days with UV. I then turned it off for General Cure for 14 days, then turned back on for hypo-salinity for another 10 days.

No issues so far and that has pretty much became part of my QT process.
 
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Thanks for the clarification.
Here’s how this was discovered.

 
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Illusiveman

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Update: Almost three weeks everything has survived the QT so far. Last white spot was seen 10 days ago. Also had a air pump failure, lucky me.

I'm starting to see some bloating on the tang. I've read that copper could have an effect on constipation in tangs. Can I still add some Epsom salt even with the copper treatment?

Tang is still eating, but I have not seen it poop. I have green nori in the tank at all times, should I removed it for a day or two? Any other suggestions?
 

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That's good news. Fish can go quite a long time without eating if they are healthy. As far as aiding with the constipation, not sure on that one. You might pm @Humblefish and get his opinion.
 

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Definitely add some Epsom salt to help with constipation. I would also remove the Nori. Just feed a bit every couple of days. Remember it also raises phosphates in the water.

What are you feeding him in QT? Any vitamins or additives? Any medications?
 

Humblefish

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You can safely add Epsom salt with copper in the water. If the constipation gets really bad, try dosing kanamycin (Seachem Kanaplex) a few times as diarrhea is a side effect.
 
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