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Pay It Forward (PIF) Program Guidelines/Theory/Concept (1 Viewer)

zeek

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HorseyStripe said:
RGH69 said:
karlo said:
If I had some SPS to give (which I have) I would want to know if who I'm giving it to has a system to grow it out and not a new setup and just kill it in a few days.

I agree, it is critical that we qualify folks or they have a freind with a more mature tank keep the coral until their tank is mature enough. For example, I am keeping another members frags in my frag tank until his tank matures.

i agree with that to an extent...question is: who gets to qualify each member? and where are we going to keep this log? this question has been brought up before...if you want to make someone the "qualifier" it would have to be someone who volunteers and can be dedicated to it...that's a LOT of pressure...

the only way i see to effectively, and efficiently do this is to make each member responsible for whomever he/she gives the piece to...that way we don't have to play "the big green meanie" and label each other publicly...i would say that if you see something that doesn't look quite right, shoot that person a PM and see what thier plans are, or post under their request...

it is the responsiblity of both the recipient and the donor to ensure proper care will be given to the coral...just like buying something from the store...

and Robert, i'm glad to hear that i figured thats what was going on, and debated on saying something myself, i'm pretty sure i know what/who you're talking about...

I could not agree more and since I know you guys are talking about me allow me to defend myself by saying I've only asked for softies :p

But seriously, I know I make myself responsible for my livestock, heck there are times when I see people post some stuff on here that I almost want to wish we had to go to school or have a liscence to have our tanks.

My father in-law wants to make the jump into sw and I almost talked him out of it I think by telling him how he should do things and so forth.

I know I usually ask members i.e. when Ron had that finger leather I pm'd him and asked him if and how to care for these, I also did that with horsey with the zoas, I explained to him my lighting and whatnot and we discussed where to place them and whatnot.

While it is mostly up to personal discretion I think the responsibility weights more on the giver then the taker and we should be more careful, this is FREE coral period.

The system should have precautions allowing people to work themselves out of it, if we are going to do it club-wide, we don't want anyone going to John demanding their membership $ back because we labeled them as coral killers LOL!
 
R

RocketSurgeon

zeek said:
we labeled them as coral killers

If the shoe fits...

We have all heard stories of LFS selling small tangs to someone with a 20 gallon high tank or a 30 long.

We know it is not an ideal situation for the tang long term. Do we fault the newbie for buying the tang, or the LFS for selling the tang? This is the same principle here.
 

RGH69

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Actually, we were not talking about either of y'all. Anyway, everyone should put some instructions concerning what you are PIFing (or selling). For example, this is what I posted for the Fire and Ice digi that I PIFed.

This coral is SPS so please make certain that your tank is fully cycled. However, I have never seen this coral die even in lower light and moderate Nitrate conditions. In poor conditions it simply won't grow. In proper conditions this coral with grow as fast as it can yank calcium out of the water. You will have to do regular water changes or supplement calcium, magnesium and strontium. Since it is a fast grower it is pretty fragile.
 

zeek

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RocketSurgeon said:
zeek said:
we labeled them as coral killers

If the shoe fits...

We have all heard stories of LFS selling small tangs to someone with a 20 gallon high tank or a 30 long.

We know it is not an ideal situation for the tang long term. Do we fault the newbie for buying the tang, or the LFS for selling the tang? This is the same principle here.

I couldn't agree more and we know better so we should do better.

I'd say The shop but there is the "profit" factor there, thats why I was saying we need a process, in my opinion everyone deserves the benefit of the doubt. I would like to believe and expect the seasoned "giver" to know better then me, but I also can't expect him to know what I know lol.

I get the circle, so we need a process, a few required questions maybe. Thats why from the very get go I posted and asked how the system worked, I believed in some ruleset then and you got my vote for us to come up with something now.

Luckily I got trained right to always ask the important questions at least(or I like to think so) :p besides I got you guys to keep me in check(craks whip) thats why I always ask my dumb questions on the general forum LMAO!
 

Mike_Reefer

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Alright you guys, Im pretty new here so let me know if Im missing some thing. But we all pay our membership dues to be part of this community and have a network of people that have the same intrests as we do. Having said that, would it not be a good idea to just let people do what they have been doing and just swap frags with thier buddies? I mean if we start getting all technical and start with the spread sheets and obligations and all that then some ones feelings are bound to get hurt. I dont see why we cant just have frag swap parties or some thing like that. Some one please let me know if Im missing the point here, because in theory it sounds like a great program and I would like to participate but, like all of you guys I got into this hobby because I enjoy it. And if you place to many expectations on people they might just decide it aint fun any more.
 

Ostentum

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The idea is to make it open to more people then the people of the"Privileged Click". There are some corals out there that people dont have the means to acquire. Thats why I have made several available in the PIF program, including the Tyree Purple Monster. 99% of the people around are going to try and charge you out the nose. Another benefit of the PIF program is that the idea is that when the coral grows out enough you pass a frag onto someone else. Lets say that the worst happens and I lose my Purple Monster colony, I know that there is a PIF floating around that I can possibly replace with a frag instead of going online paying $150 a 1/2 inch plus shipping and handling.
 

DustinB

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Definitely, the idea you (Mike) have in mind would likely only apply to the smaller groups of people that actually hang out. This allows any marsh member to get in on this kinda thing. There's nothing saying you have to do the PIF format, there is a free section at the bottom of the forums. This is just a way to give out nice frags with very minor terms, such as no profits, members only, etc... The spreadsheet is just a cool way to see how far along someone's initial donation made it.

Like Ostentum said, no one typically gives out LE acros for free, everyone usually wants close to the typical online price. I personally think it's pretty cool to pass around high end coral frags to members with the only requirement to "pay it forward" to someone else one day. If we had enough people doing this then every marsh member could have some nice stuff in their tanks, especially after things have been passed around and grown out etc...
 

zeek

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It also can asssist with propagation of specimens altogether, say for a very unfortunate reason, my tank crashes and there are a few pieces I PIF'd now my stuff is sorta banked.

I can maybe get my same old stuff back when those people PIF back! mostly because of the record we have and as Dustin said specially with the rarer, special pieces.
 

Jamie9169

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Personally I think the PIF program is an amazing thing. I have received a PIF coral from Dustin, a beautiful Turquoise Lovelli frag about two inches tall. Since he PIFed it to me I PIFed a five head green candy cane, yellow polyps and some Florida polyps, which were given to me by Flexrac over a year ago, to another member here. I have also bought many corals from members on here. The thing is if I ask for a coral that someone else is PIFing they have no clue if I can take care of it or not. Very few members here have seen either one of my set ups. You ask me questions and I can answer them however I want, telling you what you want to hear to get the coral. The PIF program is a fantastic program and I would like to see it continue. Giving coral away is a chance you take. In the right hands it will flourish but in the wrong it will die.
 

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