1st reef tank... balancing water input and output (1 Viewer)

[tbg]

sup... im trying to get my first reef tank all setup but im having an ongoing issue that im hoping is normal. hahaha (it may not be).

ive got a 200 gallon reef tank. im not positive if all reef setups are pretty much the same or not, so forgive me for describing mine if it is, but my tank has the separated back corners where the water overflows to a gravity drop to a sump, and is returned via tubes that shoot over the sides of the separation.

the issue im having is that the drop and return holes from the boxes are two different sizes (this maybe normal). i believe that the drop is 1" and the returns are... 3/4" i think. so anyways, ive got it all plumbed up with shutoff valves and all on both the drops and the returns so that if necessary, i can regulate the amount of water that goes thru each.

THE PROBLEM im having is finding the perfect drop rate. if the valves on the drops are all the way open, the water level in the intank drop boxes goes too low and the tubes take on air which causes bubbles in the return. if i close em too much, the tank level raises too high and the tank floods and the sump gets too low.

is this a common problem?!?! hahaha. surely im doing something wrong here.

thx,
tbg

 

[jdeveaux]

Can you post some pictures. The drain should be the larger hole which it sounds like you've done, but I'm not sure I follow your description of the setup.

Does your tank have Durso Standpipes?

 

[AquaNerd]

first i have to say thanks for joining us and becoming a paid member right off the bat.

onto your situation

ive got a 200 gallon reef tank. im not positive if all reef setups are pretty much the same or not, so forgive me for describing mine if it is, but my tank has the separated back corners where the water overflows to a gravity drop to a sump, and is returned via tubes that shoot over the sides of the separation.

you are describing what is called an overflow box. water flows over the overflow box and into your sump. this action causes the filtering of surface water. the surface water, if not surface skimmed, can develop a film on it, which is not a good thing.

the issue im having is that the drop and return holes from the boxes are two different sizes (this maybe normal). i believe that the drop is 1" and the returns are... 3/4" i think. so anyways, ive got it all plumbed up with shutoff valves and all on both the drops and the returns so that if necessary, i can regulate the amount of water that goes thru each.

this is normal. the drain is a standard 1" while the return line is 3/4". a 1" hole should be handle 600 gallons per hour while draining. two 1" holes would be approximately 1200 gph maximum capacity draining into your sump.

THE PROBLEM im having is finding the perfect drop rate. if the valves on the drops are all the way open, the water level in the intank drop boxes goes too low and the tubes take on air which causes bubbles in the return. if i close em too much, the tank level raises too high and the tank floods and the sump gets too low.

your return pump might be too big or you may not have enough water in your system. one other thing is that it sounds like you don't have a standpipe in your drain and the water might be falling quite a distance in your overflow box before going into the 1" drain. a standpipe is a plumbing contraption that is placed into the 1" drain and stands vertically, which will allow for more water to be "stored" in your overflow box and will prevent falling water and gurgling noises.

here's what a durso standpipe looks like:

what brand/model pump are you using to return water to the aquarium?

 

[reesetricted]

Wow, nice reply Brandon.

 

[angel4]

THE PROBLEM im having is finding the perfect drop rate. if the valves on the drops are all the way open, the water level in the intank drop boxes goes too low and the tubes take on air which causes bubbles in the return. if i close em too much, the tank level raises too high and the tank floods and the sump gets too low.

is this a common problem?!?! hahaha. surely im doing something wrong here.

thx,
tbg

camaroracer answered this question very well above and I'd like to add:

You don't need to find "the perfect drop rate" (it's the drain, btw)
"Balancing water input and output" is actually just the matter of making sure your drains have higher capacity than your return pumps.

Let's say your return pumps can pump back 600 GPH then your drains need to be able to drain "more" than 600 GPH. Let's say the drains can drain 10,000 GPH. That is perfectly ok. ( it’s an overkill, but it's still ok)

You do not lose all the water out of your main tank. If you only pump 600 GPH into it, the "overflow" only allows 600 GPH to get out.

The water level in your main tank should always be at the top of the overflow.

The water in your sump should stay at the same level except for the evaporation. You need to add back water to account for evaporation.

In my 125G, I lose 1 1/2 G a day to evaporation.

Now if you don't have an overflow and simply just have a huge drain hole at the bottom of your main tank then yes, all of your water will drain out of your tank.

 

[flexrac]

here is the instructions for DIY standpipe.
http://www.dursostandpipes.com/make-your-own-diy

 

[tbg]

1st off, sorry for the late reply... i didnt think anyone had replied to the thread cause apparentally i didnt choose to get email notifications on update. my bad...

2nd off... wow, thanks so much for the help. you guys are absolutely amazing. the reason i became a paid member right off the bat is because i had heard that you guys were like this. its rare for me to find stuff i dont mind paying for, but the knowledge and time that u guys give back is more than worth it.

k on to the problem... i think uve hit the nail on the head: i dont have the currect durso standpipes in the overflow box. when i bought the tank, it was all plumbed up and stuff, but a bulkhead had broken. i decided (like an idiot) that while replacing the bulkhead, id replumb the tank with some nice vinyl tubing instead of pvc (which im sure has downsides hahaha) and while doing it, i removed the durso standpipes and 'rebuilt' them from pvc, but not the same shape. i didnt know that the actual 'construction' of the standpipe mattered or made any difference. i took a piece of pvc and put it straight up from the bulkhead to a few inches up then put a blue grate on it to keep fish from getting sucked in. i bet thats where a lot of my problems come from. ill order some standpipes today and get that problem fixed.. i dont think i can successfully build one based on how complex the picture looks hahaha.

camaroracer was 100% right on the setup and hole sizes and everything. im not sure i completely understand about the levels, but ill reread the post and see what i can figure out once i get the standpipes in place. man, who woulda thought those little things could cause such problems

 

[chriskb3]

Vinyl tubing isnt really a bad thing, It makes plumbing quite a bit simpler. As long as it is large enough in diameter, I see no problems in using it.

Stand pipes are quite easy to make yourself, no need to special order anything. A durso merely consists of a "T", "L" (elbow, 90 deg.), and a cap fitting. All you really need is a hack saw to cut the 1" PVC to length with, and a drill to to put a small air hole in the top of the cap.

 

[flexrac]

I can help you make them if you like.

 

[tbg]

omg dude thats so nice of u to offer to help me make it!!! maybe i just freaked out looking at the breakout of 'how to make it' on the site maybe its not too bad. it just looked kinda overwhelming hahaha... but on the other hand, it outright tells u EVERY PIECE to buy and ive been hittin up the lowes for the last month or so almost every night... ill stop being a wuss and see if i can make it over the next few days. u guys r so awesome

 

[flexrac]

Good Luck!