New 180g planning ... whatcha think (1 Viewer)

[tfifeco]

Ok, I am starting the planning phase of my new 180g setup. It will be a Room divider, so both sides will be viewable and both ends will not. Here are a couple of rough sketches of what I plan to do, I do not have any set sizes of pump sizes, hole sizes or anything like that, I was hoping to get some opinions on these issues here but this sketch does show how many pumps I plan to have and how many holes. Please offer ideas and opinions, I want to do this right. I am not dead set on this design or layout let me know where the flaws are

Thanks
- Trey

 

[Guest]

I'm just curious as to whats going to happen if one of the pumps on either side goes out and the water keeps flowing down on that end :?

 

[tfifeco]

180g Planning

Well, that's a good point, I probably should have followed up these sketches with a few questions of my own. I know these sketches do not spell out all of the details of the drains and returns and the way I have the closed loops designed. I have never setup a large system like this and looking for as much advise as I can get. I guess I would ask:

1. In setting up a closed loop like the two I have shown, is it better to setup one loop with only one pump and would it be better to route the pipes some place other than the top and do you drain straight to the pump or to a bucket or tank first then return it back to the display tank?

2. Would it be better to setup the skimmer inline with the sump or seperate the way i have shown?

3. seeing this layout what GPH pump should i go with for the return from the sump and what GPH for the two pumps of the closed loops? I was thinking around 700GPH ... should it be more?

Sorry for so many questions, Any and all advise and info would be appreciated

Thanks
Trey

 

[ShaneV]

I think you will have too hard of a time trying to use two seprate pumps to go to the sump and fuge. Your better off using one pump and tee off the drain line to go to both the sump and the fuge.

This will eliminate one pump (saving the coset of the pump and the heat added to the water), and will make it MUCH easier to regulate the flow to the sump and fuge.

Also these are not considered closed loops, closed loops go from a tank through a pump back to the same tank. THese are used for flow only. The nice thing about closed loops, is you dont have to worry about water draining from them when power goes out, and you can eliminate the need for a powerhead.

 

[tfifeco]

Hey ShaneV

I guess my drawing wasn't that clear. The two green pumps stacked are actually drawn as a closed loop. I have one pipe on each side draining to each pump and then I am returning back to the main tank on at the top. The idea here is to get a better distributed flow throughout the entire tank. Does this sound odd? Is there a better way than this?

Thanks for the info

- Trey

 

[tfifeco]

180 Design

In addition, the Sump and Refug do infact have only one Drain and one return. So to talk about the closed loops, would it be better to have one Larger pump and tee if off, as you suggested or have two smaller closed loop pumps. My thought was that with two smaller pumps the cost would be less and if one went out I still had the other. What about this idea

Thanks
Trey

 

[Guest]

It's always a good idea to use 2 pumps in place of 1 when you can, for redundancy. I am using 2 closed loops on the tank I am setting up, but for a different reason. I want to use 1 closed loop to power all of my accessories (chiller, UV, etc.) that add a lot of head to the system. That way I'm not taking away flow from my main closed loop pump, which doesn't stand up to head pressure very well.

I think what is confusing everyone in your design is the skimmer - it won't work the way you have it pictured. Unless you are using an airstone driven skimmer, you need a pump to supply water to the skimmer so that it can inject bubbles into the skimmer (using a venturi, beckett, needlewheel, etc.).

I would just ditch the second sump and use just the Ecosystem as your sump. Since there problem isn't room in there for an in-sump skimmer like a Euroreef, you should go with an external skimmer, like a Beckett. Drill an extra 1.5" bulkhead in the sump to feed the skimmer - preferably from the chamber where you catch the overflow water, as it will be richest in nutrients (you'll have to ditch the bioballs in the first chamber, but that's no problem).

 

[tfifeco]

180g Design

Hey Mikester,

Thanks for the info, I do want to go with a skimmer that uses a pump rather than an airstone. I have read up enough on skimmers to know that the ones with a pump and not airstone are better, like EuroReef, etc. So you are suggesting to go with a skimmer that is Inline or in series with the eco/sump, but externally due to space. So, I would drain from the main tank to an extenal skimmer then the return side of the skimmer I would connect to the overflow side of the sump then return back to the tank, Right? Also, the sump I will be using is my old 80g display tank that I broke down several months ago, so it is not even partitioned yet, I guess I could make a large enough chamber on the overflow side to house an insump skimmer, my question is: is there any advantage/disadvantage to using an insump skimmer vs an external as you suggested. Also, it doesn't sound like there is any advantage to setting up a skimmer with its own drain and return that is seperate from the eco/sump

Thanks again

- Trey

 

[Guest]

Just to clarify - you still want the main tank to drain into the sump. If you use an external skimmer, you would use a pump to go from the sump to the skimmer, and then return the skimmer output back to the sump. Think of it as a closed loop on your sump.

By far, the easiest method is to go with an insump skimmer - less plumbing to mess with. If I had room in my sump, I would have bought a Euroreef. From what I have read, they are so easy - just drop it in the sump. If you go external, a good beckett skimmer like a My Reef Creations or a Precision Marine Bullet would be a good choice.

 

[tfifeco]

OOOOHHHHH, I see now - Excuse my ignorance I just have never setup or used a skimmer of this type before so ..... I would definitely want to setup my sump overflow chamber large enough to drop a EuroReef in there. Am I understanding this correctly? With an Insump EuroReef there is actually no plumbing at all? The intake of the skimmer and the outlet are both in the same chamber of the sump? I guess I need to read up more on the EuroReef or Insump style skimmer. I just cannot picture in my head where the outlet or overflow side of the skimmer is. Ok, so I will redisgn my skimmer layout, but what about the two pumps for the closed loops for Flow only, Would it be better to have only one pump and tee off and still route the plumbing the way it is designed and with two pumps like this would 700gph be enough or should I be looking at 1000gph or more? I mean I can get a Sedra 7000 for under $90 each. If I do 1 pump I am thinking I would need around 2000gph due head loss, and a pump this size is close to $300 from what i have seen. am I within range of my asumptions of price and size of pumps?

Thanks
Trey

 

[Guest]

What are you planning to keep? If you want to do SPS, they need a lot of flow. In that case, shoot for 20-30x the tank volume. I would look at a Sequence Reeflo pump for your closed loop. Running 1 larger pump like this is more efficient, and you still have your return pump, so if either goes out, you have 1 pump still going. A Reeflo Dart would probably be enough, or maybe step up to the next model up. I think Global has the Dart on sale this month for $200, which is about the same price you can mail-order it for.

Keep in mind that the Dart has a 2" intake. In fact, any larger flow pump will have at least a 1.5" intake, but even if the intake is 1.5" you should run 2" plumbing to the pump to handle the flow. So for your closed loop bulkheads, you need a single 2", or 2 1.5", or 4 1" bulkheads for the intake. I would go with either 2 or 4 intakes, just so you are drawing from different parts of the tank, and the suction isn't as strong at any single intake.