Urgent: need help w/ 75g: soliciting for people (1 Viewer)

[Guest]

I realize your head is spinning Kim...here's a paraphrase of what Jerel's point was. To recap he's talking to a guy who pulled out his DSB to combat his major algea problem. After 1 1/2 months of going bare bottom (and yes he scrubbed his rocks & equipment) he had the same problem.

Phosphates wicked up from the DSB and into the rocks. Now you have rock problems because of it. The rock is trying to shed the phosphates and that's what is feeding your algae right now. If you'd put the rock in the dark, it won't grow algae any more and will remain bacterial driven until it cleans itself.

Instead of throwing the rocks out he suggested

Remove most of the LR and cook it (leave those rocks in the dark for a few weeks/months depending on how dirty they are and let bacteria clean them up. You're still lighting them and letting algae feed on the nutrients.)Leave some in the tank with the animals and cook it later.

There's another thread that I'll find for you that addressed corals/polyps that are on LR that you are wanting to "cook". I'll find it for you.

 

[Guest]

PA I think I know what you have, did you test for Silicate? I am postive what is wrong is you have Silicates and the sounds like real high.

What type of water do you use, your own RO/DI? Or from a store? If your on you might have silicates in the water and need to get a new DI resin replacement with a Silicate absorber with the DI resin, or you could add another chamber to your unit.

If you are not doing your own RO/DI, or if you test it straight out of the unit isn't showing any silicates, then I would promise you it is the sand.

I forget where I read it, but one of the articles in the online mag from RC, it had an article about using Silica based Sand, and at the end the author said that you can use it, but you will forever be fighting a brown slimy algae outbreak.

The slime seems to stick to everything, even the moving figures of Xenia, and if you have any microbubbles they collect on it, and any stuff floating in the water column seems to get stuck also.

I was told I have a very high silicate in my tapwater and my RO/DI isn't taking it out, so I am getting a new DI media that has the Silicate remover on the bottom.

Hope this lights your spirits some, believe me once you get the silicates out this stuff just seems to vanish.

As far as on the glass do you scrape with a razor? you a sponge doesn't seem to remove the little small dots that this stuff grows from, if you remove the dots then it takes a couple of days for it to come back on the glass but if you just wipe it off, its back in 20 mins, (am I right?)

Nathan

P.S. I am sure it is your sand, nothing to do with the rocks, but that sand must go.

 

[PygmyAngel]

Narkon,

It's NOT the brown slimy algae. Definitely not...as I have THAT in my 20g!!!! (But if that person told you that silica-based sand breeds the brown slimy stuff too, then I should get rid of the playsand perhaps in the 20g as well...of course, as you know I am trying to sell that one anyway...)

I buy ALL my topoff water out of the glacier machines. It tells you on the machine what it is: RO, carbon-filtered, micron-filtered, ultraviolet-treated, etc.....and for my water changes, I use the Tap Water Filter from Aqua. Pharmaceuticals. So I don't have an RO/DI unit that one would connect under the sink and all. When the DI cartridge gets 'full/used up' on the TWF, I have to buy a whole new cartridge....

Well, I might try some of Allyson's suggestions. And it probably is either phosphates/silicates, etc. breeding the detritus/gunk in the sand/rocks. I think I might try the process Allyson mentions, and continue to read up on the thread in The Reef Tank.

You guys are trying really hard to be really helpful, and I am very grateful.

Those of you who have offered your assistance w/ manual labor, room for my fishes, etc....I will be calling on you soon, as soon as I come up w/ my plan. Please let me know if you have the wkd. available, or whatever is convenient for you guys.

...Still keep your ideas coming if you have had similar experience...I will try to post pictures tonight, and in the meantime I will be reading up on the sand/rock-cooking thing....

I still have some fiji pink sand/aragonite left in a bag. For more aragonite, should I just get this same kind, or does anyone know of something better I could use? Obviously, I can't use the extra bag of Playsand I have, if I don't want to use the silicate stuff anymore...

Kim

 

[Guest]

Definitely don't use any more southdown or play sand. As others have mentioned, this could be a big part of the problem. I used all Carib Sea Oolithic Aragonite and put down a 2 inch sandbed. It was expensive but I feel well worth it. I plan on keeping the top layer stirred up a little so as to remove as much deitrius as possible.

So that you can have the whole picture here's, the thread describing what his problem was. Remember, I'm just throwing info at you (I can't say for sure this is what's going on....but it sounds like a good strategy since you've already tried scrubbing everything)

http://www.thereeftank.com/forums/showthread.php?t=28059

 

[Rick]

Kim,

I used the water from the Glacier Macines outside of Eckerds and Krogers off 146 for awhile. I was having problems with the water parameters of my tank, so I tested the water straight from the machine and was shocked at the results... I don't know if there filtering was out of wack at those locations or the machines were hosed... I started going back to the LFS for water. You might try testing the water at the location your picking it up from.

 

[incysor]

Unfortunately with any algae other than some of the larger macro (bubble) algae, scrubbing the rock isn't gonna do much. There's simply too much deep in the rock that you can't clean out. Scubbing it removes the surface bits, but can't kill off what's deeper in the rock, only removing light and nutrients will kill all of it off....That said, after doing more reading I also found people that had serious brown algae blooms after using ESV carbon. After noticing what looked like rust stains on their filter bags, they put a magnet to the carbon and it turns out it was contaminated with iron. They had good results after switching to Kent carbon and doing large water changes. I'm gonna keep reading and see what else I can find. I think getting rid of the sandbed, letting your rock die-off/re-cure should probably do the trick, but I thought It'd throw the carbon thing in just in case.

B

 

[PygmyAngel]

Thanks Rick and Incysor....

Interesting on the Glacier machines!! Well, I guess I'll look into that too. And I don't use water from the same machines each time either...I will use Kroger or HEB or Arlans...just depends where I can find one....hmmmm

Also, I do use Kent Carbon, and I'll keep the carbon thing in mind for the future too.

 

[incysor]

Might try dipping a magnet in the carbon and see if it picks any pieces up. Kent could have a bad batch too...Easy thing to check off the list.

Are you sure that this is an algae bloom and not a diatom bloom?

 

[Andy]

Its PO4 & or silicates. Its coming from the water or sand. Get some water you usually use & test it. If it is OK then it is probably in your sand.
I would not throw away your rocks. Turn them over when you figure out problem. There is no light on the bottom & algea will die..

 

[Guest]

There is no light on the bottom & algea will die..

Of course this leads to more nutrients being released, so its best to do that in a tub instead of your main tank.

Some really good advice, sounds like most of the advice leads to two things:

1. Test the water, at the machine, in your tank, with a rock in a tub of clean water, sand in clean water.

2. We all need to come over and have a look at this tank, so that we know what kind of algae you have, so we know not to get any of it.

Nathan

 

[Andy]

" Andy Wrote"
Put Seachem PO4 remover, Nitrate reducer, & amonia reducer in water path in sump to keep the levels in check. Your rocks(if you have enough??) will take care of chemical process.

 

[incysor]

" Andy Wrote"
Put Seachem PO4 remover, Nitrate reducer, & amonia reducer in water path in sump to keep the levels in check. Your rocks(if you have enough??) will take care of chemical process.

Here's another suggestion to use seachem from one person on RC to another that was having either a diatom outbreak or brown algae bloom.

If it is diatoms your best bet if it does not perish by itself is to get rid of Silicates.
Comes from your Top off water. Do you have an RO/DI unit?

The best Silicate remover I know is Seachem's Phosgard. Which by the way once done puling out the Silicate will also remove the Phosphate. Wash it well in RO/DI water to remove the dust and reduce the amount of Aluminum released. Some softies are somehow sensitive and may shrink for a while but they will be OK as soon as you are done using it.
For those fans of Rowaphos and Phosban the reason I recomend Phosgard for this application is:

a) It seems to remove Silicate faster and in larger amounts.
b) It's use is temporary for this application
c) Given the amounts and frequency of replacement needed (every 4 to 7 days) it will be a lot cheaper proposition

 

[PygmyAngel]

Narkon's right: you guys should come over and look and learn & suggest....I don't mind...just let me have a warning so I can clean up first!

...And the hair algae is well, more like: 'long hair detritus w/ a little bit of hair algae'...really, hard to explain. It's like the detritus-y stuff has come alive and become an algae of its own...sigh.

....Incysor, you are skimming my posts! I explained thoroughly what kind of unit I have!!! The TWF (Tap Water Filter), which is a DI unit that you just replace the DI cartridge when it is all used up.

...Okay, guys, I do have some diatoms and some cyano in the tank as well. I expected this anyway, as remember the tank recycled because I did the 99% water change when I tore the tank and redid it a month and a half ago, plus I mentioned earlier that the tank has needed more flow...but this detritus-hair-algae has come back full force after everything was sparkling, recycling, etc...and each day it looks like someone just dumps crap in it.

....Also, I think something that is compounding it, especially since we agree I have crappy sand that is releasing phosphates, silicates, whatnot...well, is a red coris wrasse that I recently got from Jim...it likes to stir up and stay under the sand 80% or so of the time...so I think it's just making the problem occur even faster since I probably have a 'sand/rock' prob. So not only were things already getting smothered, but this wrasse likes to go and stir up sand and help it and all the released crap settle right onto the rocks....grrr.

....I think I need to have a MARSH gathering at my house for those who want to look and learn, suggest and advise, and those who are going to help me do the tear down/fix up... I'll get drinks, food, entertainment (I live on the water and we could bbq and stuff )....and get ourselves learnt' and enlightened on what's 'all wrong with this tank' and how to correct these types of probs.

(We might as well do the same w/ the 20g anyway)....[glow=darkred:176ce9f9e6][/glow:176ce9f9e6]

 

[djreef]

I'm in. Systemic problems are my forte'.

DJ
= 8-->{I>

 

[PygmyAngel]

...Okay, that's one signed up....taking reservations now.

(Well, I do have the commitment of some of the Clear Lake / Seabrook people coming....whenever we figure out when that will be)...

 

[incysor]

....Incysor, you are skimming my posts! I explained thoroughly what kind of unit I have!!! The TWF (Tap Water Filter), which is a DI unit that you just replace the DI cartridge when it is all used up.

....I think I need to have a MARSH gathering at my house for those who want to look and learn, suggest and advise, and those who are going to help me do the tear down/fix up... I'll get drinks, food, entertainment (I live on the water and we could bbq and stuff )....and get ourselves learnt' and enlightened on what's 'all wrong with this tank' and how to correct these types of probs.

(We might as well do the same w/ the 20g anyway)....[glow=darkred:64b1e28bd0]
[/glow:64b1e28bd0]

Sorry for the confusion...I'm not skimming your posts....It was part of the response from the RC member...I should have put quotes around it or something so it would be clearer. Like this.

Here's another suggestion to use seachem from one person on RC to another that was having either a diatom outbreak or brown algae bloom.

"If it is diatoms your best bet if it does not perish by itself is to get rid of Silicates.
Comes from your Top off water. Do you have an RO/DI unit?

The best Silicate remover I know is Seachem's Phosgard. Which by the way once done puling out the Silicate will also remove the Phosphate. Wash it well in RO/DI water to remove the dust and reduce the amount of Aluminum released. Some softies are somehow sensitive and may shrink for a while but they will be OK as soon as you are done using it.
For those fans of Rowaphos and Phosban the reason I recomend Phosgard for this application is:

a) It seems to remove Silicate faster and in larger amounts.
b) It's use is temporary for this application
c) Given the amounts and frequency of replacement needed (every 4 to 7 days) it will be a lot cheaper proposition"

I think your idea to have folks over to look at the tank is a good one. I'll try to make it if I'm not busy. Although my free weekends are disappearing at a rapid rate.

 

[Guest]

Although my free weekends are disappearing at a rapid rate.

Its not just you, its happening to us all, it seems.

Depending on the day, you might count us in. Of course I say this before I have spoken to the boss.

Nathan

 

[PygmyAngel]

Okay, I have to take my son to a soccer game on Saturday morning at 10:30, and it lasts about an hour. I should be ok after that.

Those of you willing to come and help w/ the tank...is Saturday or Sunday of this weekend ok for you? One day better than the other? Both?
Please let me know, and/or pm me w/ your #s and I'll call for arrangements, directions, details, etc.
If you guys really want to come by and help, I will have some food/drinks. If I don't hear back I will start pm'ing people.

I have 2 (poss. 3) large rubbermaid bins, several white containers for making saltwater, but I probably could use a few more, if I am going to keep rocks, corals, and fish all separate, as suggested before....if anyone can bring extras w/ them, that would be great.

I guess I should look into Seachem Phosgard. I do have Kent's Phosphate Sponge....I wonder if it is any better or worse than Phosgard.

Oh, and I took photos last night....and of course, it was after the daylight bulbs went off, so the photos will be purple-ish and not great (I don't know how to use this Olympus digital camera-it's not mine, and I have no idea how to work the settings...sigh. I seriously need Digi. Cams 101...).

Anyway, I'll post them shortly, if I can get them to a decent clarity....

Meanwhile...for those of you who can come help, or just want to watch and learn, please be thinking of what are good times for you, and what you want to eat/drink. Give me feedback, and I will try to work majority / mutual convenience.

Kim

 

[incysor]

The following two weekends are no-go for me, but I do have several containers you can borrow. Maybe I can send them down with someone coming from Houston? And the offer is still open to host critters. I could probably come down and get them from you on Sunday evening, or meet you halfway, or just let you bring them to me, so you can see where they'll be staying.

 

[Rick]

Kim,

I would let you put some things in my tank, but I'm still working on my tank, and not sure the water parameters are that great in mine...
I know the nitrates run about 40 ppm, I will check the other parameters this weekend and let you know.

Cleaned out filters and tank last night, just in case I have any new guests in my tank this weekend.

If you'd like to let me know.